Unfiltered-ish

The One Where We Ask If Manifestation Is Real

• Carina Gardner, Nicki Krawczyk, and Natali Edmonds

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What if the thing you’re trying so hard to force is the thing you actually need to loosen your grip on?

In this episode of Unfiltered-ish, Natali, Carina, and Nicki talk about manifestation, belief, signs, surrender, control, joy, prayer, and what it means to take action without trying to micromanage the entire universe. What starts with sleep, Oura Rings, and whether starting a university ruins your rest turns into a deeper conversation about goals, faith, business, money, intuition, and learning how to trust the next step.

Natali shares the story of wanting to write a book, starting before she knew how it would happen, and then getting an unexpected email from Wiley Publishing. Carina talks about belief, preparation, religion, personal revelation, and realizing she had stopped believing in one of her own big dreams. Nicki gets honest about feeling stuck, wanting signs, trying to surrender, and the difficulty of not controlling the outcome when your business and life feel uncertain.

We also talk about joy as part of manifestation, why breaks might create better ideas, the “castor oil” meditation moment, being the hype girl for other people’s success, and whether everything going perfectly would even be good for us.

If you’ve ever wanted a sign, tried to manifest something, struggled to surrender, or wondered whether joy and play might actually be part of the plan, this episode is for you.

Unfiltered-ish is the midlife group chat for women talking honestly about friendship, ambition, marriage, dating, money, aging, reinvention, joy, and wanting more out of life.

SPEAKER_04

Hi, I'm Karina, and I usually get about seven hours and fifteen minutes of sleep during the night.

SPEAKER_01

Hi, I'm Nikki, and I get, yeah, like I want to say probably eight, seven and a half, eight hours of sleep. I love sleep. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03

Hi, I'm Natalie. And yeah, I get on average about eight hours of sleep. Love it when I can get more.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

I think we were just talking about this. So my aura ring, I I would tell everyone I get eight to nine hours of sleep. But based on what's actually happening, it looks like I usually only get about seven hours of sleep. Like I'm in bed for an extra hour, but I wake up a lot.

SPEAKER_01

So when's the last time? Can you remember the last time that you were sleeping that you went to bed and you didn't get up in the middle of the night? Yeah, I do. Isn't that so sad?

SPEAKER_02

Before Siri.

SPEAKER_04

No, it was before I started the university. Oh, yeah. It's so very clear in my mind, like what happened before the university and what has happened after the university. So uh note to everyone else out there, if you start a university, no, you will stop sleeping so well. I think there were like some other things that happened around that same time that made it so that I didn't sleep as well. I I also think just age, right? Aging. Um, so I'd hit what I was 44. Um, but I also think I got really, really sick and my allergies started getting really bad. And I think I just never ever bounced back from that sickness because my sinuses were always clogged, and I just didn't realize it. And so I was waking up often in the night unable to breathe. And I I just didn't realize that's what was going on. So, anyway, that's not what we're gonna talk about today, though, because we've promised you guys an amazing manifestation episode. Wait, don't promise it's gonna be amazing. We don't know it's gonna be amazing. Oh, I'm gonna I'm gonna be a baseline. Promise that we're gonna talk about it. So that being promise. That'll be amazing. Actually, I think Natalie needs to kick us off on this because she is the queen of this whole manifesting thing. Yeah, you make shit happen.

SPEAKER_03

That's so interesting. I really don't feel like that, but I can see why you might say that. So I think just recently I've had some ideas and then think like the universe just gives me certain signs or opportunities that maybe that is a good idea, you know. So um, I think one of the things that comes really easily to me is just people wanting to feature me in their stuff, you know, like I have something coming out with USA Today, I think in a week or two. And formerly MSNBC, now MS Now, wants to do some things, but it's all in line with like what I'm talking about. Like I was thinking about doing a kind of a US News and Weekly World Report status update. And then literally US News and Weekly emailed me and was like, hey, would we would like to feature you in this? And I'm like, oh, okay. Like that's fine. Like that's so interesting. What are the chances? I'm not sure what else has happened, but I feel like a lot of things like that happened.

SPEAKER_01

I feel like that can we talk about the uh is this sign language? What is it? It is sign language, but like you can't figure out what this is. Oh, the book. Yeah, yes. Can we talk about I know it's from the side, you're right. From the side, it's really hard to tell from the front if that makes a whole lot more sense. Um yeah, so it's gonna, I can't remember, you know, when it comes out and yeah, I guess you would be able to, because you're making it public. That's right. You have the banner. It is now. But like that feels like a prime example to me. Because I feel like you were like, you know, like I really like to write a book. And it feels like a week later, you were like, Yeah, Wiley Publishers reached out and they wanna they want to do a book with me.

SPEAKER_03

Like, so I think probably like we've all learned about manifestation, I suppose, or heard of it. But when I think about the book in general, I think I really was following the steps of what they say. So for example, I knew I wanted to write a book, but I kind of started already putting words to paper. I was like, I don't know what I'm doing or what this is really is, but I would wake up some mornings and I would just type a little bit. And but I didn't have any pressure that how am I gonna get it published? I did think a little bit, like, should I self-publish or should I traditionally publish? I actually uh went to a psychic and asked them. Like, so I did have like that question. I wasn't quite sure. Um, but there was no pressure at all in terms of can I do this? When will I do it? When will it come out? It was just I want to write a book. And then I lived my life. And one morning on the pickleball courts, I got a message from my from Jenna, my assistant, and was like, Can you tell me why somebody from Wiley Publishing is emailing asking about if you've ever considered writing a book? Oh, I should back up. I would literally say a week prior, um, I one of my friends sent me a book that said like how to find a literary agent. Because that's the thing. Like she was like, You probably need to find a literary agent. And I was like, Oh, so she sent me this book and I opened it up and it's all these steps and addresses of people. And I'm like, this seems like a lot. So I go to Amazon and I order one and send it to Jenna because I'm about to have Jenna do it all. I don't know what to do with this, right? And so that's why Jenna was like really shocked by it, because I had just ordered her this like a guide to getting a literary agent when she emailed and said, Why is Wiley Publishing emailing you? And I was like, Oh, so I think the key lessons there were one, I had a goal. Two, I started working on it without waiting for an agent or anything like that. Three, I was doing something I really loved, like playing pickleball, I was having fun, I was still doing my thing. And so I think it just is like easy to come because I had no hangups about it. Like I literally had no fears or concerns that I would ever write a book. I didn't know how I was going to do it, but I didn't actually waste any time on it. And I think that's one of the fundamentals of manifestation, right? You have to loosen your grip or control. And so I didn't have any of that with this book situation.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, I think I I remember the book situation as well too. And I felt like you had taken a lot of the steps. So you were prepared for it. I think that if you'd said, I want to write a book and you had done nothing when that John Wiley email came in, I think it would almost be a knee-jerk reaction because you would like be like, Well, what am I supposed to do with this? Right.

unknown

Right.

SPEAKER_04

So so there is like, there is something here, I think, with manifestation and being prepared and then the thing happening because there feels like there's something with all of that. I've been having these thoughts about manifestation because uh, like, well, for the most part, I'm like, I don't believe in this, you know, like, you know, I kind of feel like it's a little woo-woo. That being said, I have total faith in preparation makes for the thing to happen, right? Which is basically manifestation. You say you want this thing, you prepare yourself for it, and then it typically comes in some way, shape, or form. But I was thinking about how really and truly the things that I want to have happen, I already have a belief that it's going to happen before it happens. Yes. That's a really weird way to say it. But basically, I was thinking about I've been writing in my so I do uh like uh 10 dreams that I write down not every day, but often several times a week. I write down them down, and there's been a couple on there that I think I have not been believing. Like I did believe maybe three or four years ago, but I wasn't sure if I believed anymore. And I had set my standards a lot lower. And about two or three days ago, something came into play. Josh and I were talking about something, and I suddenly was like, wait, wait. I think that thing I've been writing down that's going to happen. And suddenly I believed it again. And I have been believing it, and now my actions, all the steps I'm taking, are towards that belief because I'm like, this is gonna happen. Like, I know it's gonna happen. I don't know when it's gonna happen, but it's gonna happen. And so I better just start preparing my entire team for this thing to happen. And so I don't know what it is about manifestation, like the whole idea that there's a manifestation and then you believe it, and then you take all these action steps to make sure it happens, and then it happens.

SPEAKER_03

So we're the thing that blocks people from manifesting, though, is they set goals and they have these desires, but they don't believe it. And when they don't believe it, it they block it from happening. So it's almost like you you have to be the one to not care so much about it. And when you don't care so much about it, you kind of are in a little bit more of a receptive role about it. Like I don't care at all about these publication uh editorial feature opportunities and they just keep happening because like that's that's something that I'm like, yeah, okay, like sure, nothing. But then I have like maybe a hang up on finances, and then it feels harder because I don't believe it. So I almost feel like if you were to just focus on the little beliefs more, it helps roll the other manifestations coming along.

SPEAKER_04

Along those same lines, I was thinking about this particular thing I've been thinking about. And it is actually a monetary thing that I know will happen to the university, it will get to this particular number. But I think I had stopped believing it because I kept thinking, we're just gonna be a boutique university, we're gonna stay small, we're gonna da-da-da-da. And a couple of things happened that made me realize, oh, Karina, this is not gonna be small, this is gonna be big, and you need to start preparing for it. And the thing that came to me was even though we were saying this particular number for what the university will be, I do not actually care about the number, the financial number. I know that my family is fine without that number. It's more about can we get this into the hands of this many designers out there? And that is what will produce this particular number. So I do think there is something to that, not caring about and not controlling when it will happen, because I kind of am like, this will be great if it happens. It's because it'll be the best thing ever for people, but it's okay. I don't care when it happens.

SPEAKER_03

It I also think it's not just when it happens, it's also how it happens. Like you have to be willing for it to come in maybe a different way, if that makes sense. So, like what I write down my journal or my visions, it's always this or something better. Because the universe, like we have to go with that too. It's not, we don't know what's best for us all the time.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, I feel like I have to do that as well. Like, cause I'll say, I want this or better. Like always, because I'm like, Krina, why are you just limiting yourself at this? Yes.

SPEAKER_03

Nikki, what are your thoughts?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, no, as you guys are talking, I'm just thinking because I I feel very mired in like I feel like I'm not making progress. And you guys know, I mean, this morning on Marco Polo, I was like, feeling better. But um, yeah, I do, I mean, I know that that trying to control things is definitely a a life lesson for me to learn. Um and then at the same time too, you know, the the stuff that I'm so hung up on is the direction of the business. And the and the the direction of the business guides the direction of my life. And the direction of the business is driven by by finances. And the finances for the business are so up in the air, they shouldn't be. I think it blows my mind that they are to the degree that they are. Um, like we're fine, but you know what I mean? Like it's it's so I'm I'm mired in this this kind of well, what's gonna happen next and what's gonna and how can I how can I make things just like go back to the way they were or not back to the way they were, but like get them to a steady place. And how can I make them and because I don't I'm concerned that if I, you know, the the like sit back and just let them when you don't know what to do, don't do anything. That is the antithesis to who I am. Like if you don't know what to do, well you have to do something, you know. Like well, and also we run businesses. At no point am I gonna be like, guys, I don't know what to do for the business, so I'm just gonna do anything. Like that just seems like the most irresponsible thing in the entire world. Um, you know, whether you believe in manifestation or whether you don't believe in manifestation, like not doing anything for an afternoon, sure, but like, oh, I can't make this decision, so I'm just not going to do anything. Yeah, I think I'm I'm I feel very like I'm like I'm in mud. I feel like I've been trying to get through, like trying to bicycle through mud for a long time now. And it's so frustrating because it shouldn't be this difficult. And I feel like I'm like, okay, okay, just keep going. I'm gonna get out of the mud. And what I'm doing instead of getting out of the mud is like digging myself deeper into the mud. Um, and it's like at this point, I'm like, I don't, I how do you even there's a lot of mud here, even if I get off the bike, it's it's where am I gonna get to, you know, how am I gonna get to the solid ground? That that doesn't even seem like a solution either.

SPEAKER_04

So although your same analogy there or metaphor, I don't know what it is, but but I mean, I think it's like to get to that manifestation state, you do have to walk through the mud until you can find the hard ground to walk on again. I I really think that's it because we've been so mired with unbelief, and I have been there where I'm just like, I don't know if I believe any of this anymore, like about whatever, you know, anything that I had a belief once that my autistic daughter would never be able to live away from home. Like I had a true belief that after her diagnosis that she was never going to be able to live by herself. And I know other parents of teenagers who have autistic kids truly believe that they've come to talk to me about it because I have this kid, they're like, your autistic daughter lives on her own. And I'm like, she does. And when I was in your stage, I didn't believe it either, right? And so I do think we're looking for little signs from the universe that this thing, this belief that we have that we need to like maybe break down so that we can have a bigger belief. We have to be looking for those signs because otherwise we're stuck. Yeah. And I don't know that that was a great example of manifestation, but I do think our own beliefs are holding us back because that's why we don't manifest bigger things.

SPEAKER_03

I do think it's important to also have working in your regular life true things that bring you joy. Even when not everything in your life is going great and there are things we don't know, we still have to. It reminds me a little bit of like the what is it, the artist state or the artist way. The artist way, artist Julia Cameron. Yeah, I I think it's important that we are still experiencing joy even when things are not going well, to like allow ourselves to have the epiphanies, the insights, the drop-ins. And I don't know how you two feel in terms of like, are you doing things that you feel are really bringing you joy?

SPEAKER_01

I mean, you guys absolutely know that I am not. You know that I am absolutely aside from the time I spend with you, or like time, not that not that, you know, visiting my mom, not that that isn't, you know, nice, but like like, oh, I'm just genuinely having a really good time. Like no, on a daily basis, absolutely not. More than anything else, it's my day is crammed with work.

SPEAKER_04

I think my world is crammed with work, but I genuinely, absolutely love my life. I think that's the difference between Nick, because I think Nick and I are both working a lot of hours right now. Um, but I was even thinking about my last night. I mean, I had a meeting you guys from 6 to 7 p.m. last night. Like I worked the longest day, but I had Pilates from seven to eight. And so I went and I tried to exercise my brain in a good way. And then I came home and it's just feeling like summer in Utah, finally, you know, and Charlie had one more day of school, and I just looked at Charlie and Josh, and Felicity's been gone for a week, and Siri's not home. And I'm I'm I think I'm definitely feeling this like, oh my gosh, we're gonna be empty nesters soon. And I said, let's take a walk up to yogurt stop and go get some some ice cream. And Charlie was like, okay, I'll do that. And sometimes he's a little doesn't a little punk and he doesn't want to do that. And Josh was all about it. And so we walked up there, ended up buying Chinese food and yogurt stop, walked home. I ate way too late, which causes all kinds of issues at night for me. But it was like, I don't know, like, even though I only had like basically two hours of my day be this like delightful experience, that was all I needed for me to then start my day again this morning and be like, okay, Karina, you're back in the grind. So, Nick, I think that's what you're missing, that one little piece. You know what I'm trying to do. I'm just trying to convince you to move into the barn so that you can go to yogurt stuff. I'll be back there in like a month.

SPEAKER_03

What about you and Adeline? Oh, I have joy. I like when I play pickleball, I just have so much fun. I'm connecting, I'm socializing, it's beautiful. I also have so much joy whenever I just look at Nico. Like, especially if I'm working and I look over and Nico is sleeping and he's just like so out of it. I'm like, my heart, literally, I feel like I could feel my heart experience some sort of explosion. I have so much joy. Sometimes too, I just like have joy like just looking around. I'm like, oh, this is beautiful. Like I experience that. I do feel like I have a lot of joy in my life on a regular basis. Um is everything perfect? No. But I think pickleball, my dog, and my home really, really help. Um I love that pickleball was first on that list. Well, let's be honest. I feel that like it's I'm meeting new people, beautiful places. Like, and it doesn't feel like the pressure of like I really have to get to know you. It's more of like we have we talk, you know, as we can between games, and I get we get to go on and then we get to wait till the next text message when somebody wants to play. There's no pressure whatsoever. So uh I love that. I've been doing a new meditation, and then there's a new prayer I want to try that I learned that I haven't learned of. But if you guys want to hear, I'll share.

SPEAKER_04

Yes, please do.

SPEAKER_03

Okay, so first of all, you know how I've been making bracelets, my care blazer bracelets.

unknown

Yes.

SPEAKER_03

Well, I made this one. It's actually super cute, and I wouldn't wear it.

SPEAKER_04

I just want to say this is why Natalie cracks me up because she gets so much joy out of crafting. Like she's like one day on MarkoPole, like building these little friendship bracelets. I was like, in another life, Natalie would have been one of my designers.

SPEAKER_03

Like honestly, like also like sometimes when I'm like, you know, just like not thinking, I'll just like color or whatever. But anyway, so this bracelet says agape. Oh yeah. Do you know what that means?

SPEAKER_04

No.

unknown

No.

SPEAKER_03

Agopi.

SPEAKER_04

Wait, will you spell it? A-A-P-E.

SPEAKER_01

Sorry.

SPEAKER_03

A-P-E, yes.

SPEAKER_04

A-G-A-P-E. No, what's the origin? I feel like it's a spelling contest. What's the origin? Use it in a sentence.

SPEAKER_03

Um, it means like universal love, like the highest vibration. So what I've been doing, I first of all, my favorite kind of meditation is just in silence. And I feel like I try to do that every day for like at least five minutes of just like clearing it out because maybe I get some downloads. But this meditation is really what I do is I first of all, I picture people I really love. So I go for at least five people. And I always start off with Nico, even though he's not a person, because he's very easy to drop into this, like so open up my heart. Like I just, so I just like picture Nico and I just like I wish him the most health. I wish him joy. I wish him to have like the most fun, beautiful life. And I just picture him and I feel so happy. Then I usually picture like you two ladies, and it's usually together of like, I just wish you health and wealth and happiness, and like I just like just pour all of this into you guys and like that. You guys are like live your life of your highest potential. Then I usually picture a friend and I'm wishing that you know he has his life of highest potential and wealth and health and all of that. And then, so I usually five people, I'll picture Eric and I'll do that for him too. And then I um I go to myself. So I picture it myself and I try to picture myself of like, I wish you health and wealth and your highest potential. And I'm just like shining light on everybody. But then what I do is I step back and then I picture all of my caregivers and I picture them of like I try to bring them peace and I try to bring them safety and I try to bring them health. Then the final thing I do is I step back and I picture the whole world. And for some reason, I don't know why. I go to India with like tons of people like walking in a market and it's like all crowded. And I, you know, I just wish like that they all have like shelter and water and food and health and wealth and that nobody struggles. It's just like this meditation of like love for everyone. But the unique thing is it's like it's including myself as well in there, which is like usually not a thing. Uh and I really love it. It's like I'm not asking, well, I mean, I guess I am asking for a lot, but I'm not asking for anything of myself that I don't want for everybody else. And there's something really beautiful that feels there. Like I just feel like it's a little bit like it's just good for everybody. And I've really been enjoying that because, like, you know, I was struggling a little bit visualizing like my house and my life and what am I doing. And it's like, no, I just want everybody to have like this, these things that are really great. So that's a meditation. But there's something I learned recently called the scientific prayer.

SPEAKER_04

I was just gonna say what you just did sounds exactly like a prayer. So, like especially in the LDS church, you're supposed to say all the things you're thankful for first. So I'm thankful for my kids. I'm thankful. So it's like bringing in the gratitude before you ask. So that's you always talk about all your great things you're great, thankful for before you ask.

SPEAKER_03

So I am asking here, but I'm not asking in particular, like I'm not asking for like money or I guess you know, just yeah. And I'm I'm I'm wanting it for the people in my life first, beyond me or something. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01

Why do you think than asking?

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, I was gonna say, why do you think you do that? Does it just make you feel better? Because you feel like you're before you can accept, you need everybody else also to accept.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, maybe something like that. It feels more comfortable with me, just like um it's not selfish, it's giving. It's not just me. And I feel like the universe might respond better when I'm trying to help everybody and not just myself.

SPEAKER_04

That makes sense. Yeah, totally makes sense. I also think good intentions and good karma go a long way.

SPEAKER_03

And and starting it out, actually, though, I think the main reason why I started out with picturing like the five people I really love is it it opens my heart. You know, like always start with Nico, and it's just like I have no resistance. I have absolutely no resistance. I'm all in because it's feels so nice, right? Um, sometimes I'll picture my brother or my sister or something like that. Like sometimes the people change slightly. Um always starts with Nico, which is so crazy. Um, okay, real quick though, this scientific prayer, I I have to like, I screenshotted it, so I don't know it. You you can like have your eyes open and learn learn it and then like adapt it for your own. But um, how many steps is it? It's Karina, you uh okay. One, two, three, four, five, six. There's six steps. No, seven. This might be too long. I might have to reconnect, but here are the thoughts, here are the basics of it. Step one, surrender. So you basically like, I surrender, I now fully and completely let go and release all worries and desires. I surrender every aspect of my life to the infinite loving intelligence of the universe. I realize I can't do everything myself or solve every problem. I need help and fully surrender my ego, all my human logic. I open myself completely to the guidance and help of the universe. I surrender. So that's like step one. Then step two, you basically are like, I know. I know we are one and we are connected. I have been leaning into this a lot. Like I know you are fully present for me. And in me, in this moment, you hear every word I speak. I know you're already helping me. I know you're fully aware of all the aspects of my life. We are one, we know. So it's like I surrender, I know. Next is I am ready. You're like, I'm ready, I'm ready to co-create. I'm ready to co-create my reality through my thoughts, my words, my actions, my my vibrations. I know that my thinking is the cause of all of my challenges. I'm ready to have my limiting beliefs and thought patterns upgraded. Then it goes to like, I forgive and I love. I forgive, I know I'm forgiven for any harm I've ever caused. I now forgive anybody who's ever caused any harm for me. I love all people, um, no matter how anyone acts. Oh, I forgot. Sometimes in that meditation, I will picture somebody I have a hard time with. Well, I already kind of mentioned one person. But basically, like I will picture and purposely just send love to that person. So like even if it's somebody I don't really like. Um, and then um I declare. So now this is your time to declare your desire. So after you've done all that, you can say, um basically, whatever it is that you, you know, I declare now in this state of surrender, knowing oneness, forgiveness, universal love. I declare that boom, whatever you want to have happen. Um, and then you end with thank you, like thank you for the manifestation of these intentions. Thank you for accepting this into my life right now. So just a little bit more like again, it's not just me, me, me, give, give, give. It's like, hey, I surrender. We're creating together. I forgive everybody, I love everybody. Here's what I'm working on. Done, you know. I don't know. It feels very sentence to us. I'll send out send it to you.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. Yeah. It sounds, it feels very positive. I also think everything that you said, there were like certain things that you said in that that I was like, yeah, that's true. That's true. That it feels like universal truths. Like, for example, it's only our own thoughts. What is it that it said? Like we're it's only ourselves that get in our way. It's like our own thoughts, our own beliefs, our own things that like you have to release that. I also like that it opens up, it's exactly how you do your meditation of vulnerability, right? I'm going to open myself up to be vulnerable for a second, which I think is really hard to do, especially if you've had a hard life. And I don't think any of the three of us have had extremely hard lives, but we've had difficult things happen in our lives. Um, and so, you know, even when you got to the part where like you're going to be open to everyone, I was like, that's real hard for me. That's really hard for me. Yeah. Important, but hard, you know? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, I like that a lot.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Some interesting things in that. And so sometimes I do think like maybe some of the things I do could be viewed as a distraction or viewed as, hey, like you should really be working right now. But sometimes I see things as like playing pickleball, going to the gym, cleaning my home. I see that as my mind just starting to like let some of this soak in and percolate and see what happens without the con. Like I am working, but to continue to like press buttons on something I'm not even sure is really what I want or the direction I want to go, I feel like sometimes these breaks help me recalibrate and like reset and sit back down with a little bit more clarity.

SPEAKER_04

Well, you just might have hit on something, Natalie. I mean, you are our idea girl in this group, but when I'm really considering my life, when do I get my best ideas? In the shower, in the hot tub, when I'm floating on the pool, when I'm doing relaxing activities. And maybe Nikki and I don't have as much open playtime in our lives for those good ideas to come.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

I wonder if it might be worth scheduling, at least for you, Nikki, right now. Like, what would playtime look like for you? Especially with how things are, you know, how things are about to look in the next couple of months. Like what would it even be?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

I don't know.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's a good question. I I don't know. And even as you were talking to you, like I'm open to surrendering and open and I or I surrender. And I think, I mean, and I think you guys will be like, uh, yeah, Nick, we're so glad you're figuring this out. But I think I have been I'm like, I surrender. I am open to whatever. But it also has to include this. Like, this is like, okay, I surrender, I will go whatever direction as long as this is also a part of it. And um I think that that has to change. So, you know, have I been truly surrendered? Very clearly not. Have I been truly not controlling things? Very clearly not. Um and I think that there are some challenges with that. Mostly because then it gets then I get into the okay, well then, well then what? And then which I understand that with all the with the manifestation ethos or with even with like when it comes to religion and God and you know, whatever that that's not in your hands, it's there's a a greater plan for you. Um which I get a little bit like, yes, I want to believe in a greater plan than the one that I have, which is the mo the the ultimate in like uh arrogance, you know, like if there is a higher power that I believe I have a better plan than whatever that higher power has. Um but that is yeah, I think I think giving up that level of control and truly being like, okay, then I don't know. Then I don't know is a little bit nerve-wracking, a little bit like, okay, well then but okay, if I don't know, then what am I doing? And where am I going? And and am I starting over again in in life, you know? I want I want the easy stuff.

SPEAKER_04

I can't see where you come from because I think I'm a little bit of a control freak. But it's so funny because even as I listen to Natalie talk about the higher power, or you're talking about it now, I was just like, I don't think I I don't think I hold on as hard as I think I do, because I do believe it's all gonna work out. I've I've and that's partly because of my religion. I believe that there is a loving and caring Heavenly Father who is going to make it work out for me and my children and my husband and the people I know. And I'm not worried about it. Do I want to do things? Yes, but I figure that he's going to stop me in my tracks if I'm doing the wrong thing. I have a belief that he's expecting me to do the work, and I'm just gonna do the work. And if it's not supposed to work, it's not supposed to work.

SPEAKER_03

What does it look like for God to stop you in your tracks?

SPEAKER_04

Oh, good. Well, I I actually think Design Suite is there. Like it wasn't getting the membership that it needed to in order for me to continue doing that. To me, that it's not because of my lack of trying, because I tried. And so if it's not if it's not working, then it's time to be done. And that's got to be okay. I release it, like it's okay that that program has now morphed into the university, and I have to be okay with that. If if for some reason something happens at the university making it impossible for me to run it, it was not meant to be, Karina. Like it just was not meant to be because it's not going to be from lack of trying. Like if I'm doing everything I'm supposed to be doing and then it doesn't work, then to me, I I wasn't supposed to be doing that.

SPEAKER_03

How long do you give it to try? Does that make sense? Like before you realize it's not working.

SPEAKER_04

Like we believe in personal revelation. So all I have to do is pray and ask. And if I get the right feeling or the right thing to come to me, then I'll just do it. Have you guys ever had the experience of asking for a sign and getting it? I don't ever ask for signs. I ask for an answer. And I have had like true revelation type experiences that were I was like, that was not me. I know that wasn't me. And so because of that, I will do exactly and I think that's your like Natalie, when you ask for a sign, I think it's that for you. So I think it's funny because we talk about you know organized religion and then the universe, and but I in a lot of ways they kind of sync up. They it's different words for the same things. I agree.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

How do you know, Natalie? Do you feel do you feel as I do? Well, both of you, do you guys feel as I as you I do that like if I'm not supposed to do something, I will just be stopped in it and I will just obey? Like I will just make a change.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, maybe I just really have to be hit over the head with something. Like I really it has to be like a billboard that's like Nick, knock it off. Um because I feel like uh like I feel like I'm at that kind of crossroads at this moment. And I really would have liked to get this information a little bit more, a little sooner. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_04

Like a little bit like, hey, this uh but Nicky I was, but also little hints from the universe.

SPEAKER_01

You want the big billboard sign? I guess so. The little hints were the good stuff, the little hints were like, look at this fun synchronicity, you're being taken care of. But it's the the the guidance that seems to be need to be very flip and obvious in order for me to go, uh okay. Well then where do I go now? Yeah, yeah. So when it like signs, I I think I've gotten I've I I believe I've gotten signs from my dad. Like when he didn't you guys that when he the day that he passed, um the girls came to take the the body and the like the light flickered. Um like the one of the girls looked up. I just I don't know why they send women to take bodies. He almost fell down the stairs. Um it's a whole big thing. Uh but like the light flickered and I looked up and she both looked up and we kind of our eyes met and then you know back to the task at hand. Um and then the the fire alarms that same night that my dad passed, uh the fire alarm went off and the top of the stairs and the or on the top floor, and then it also went off in the bottom floor. Um, like I think I've gotten things like that from him, but I don't know. I feel like I will get maybe like little synchronicities here and there, like, oh, I just I was I heard something and I was just reading that word in this book, you know, or something. And it won't be a word that means anything, but just like a okay, you're you're lined up here. Um I don't know if I feel like I've gotten that in a while. I'm not complaining, I promise. Um but yeah, I don't, I feel like when I ask for, you know, how all the all the manif manifestation people and all the some of the mediums and all the they're like, ask for a sign and you'll get your sign. And if you don't get your sign, then that's a sign in itself. And I'm like, well, I never get a sign. Whenever I'm like, okay, universe, God, whatever you want me to call you, I have a feeling you don't care, but like whatever. Can't I you don't care what you call me, nut or what I call you not with a sign, but like send me a sign that I will completely understand. Or like sometimes I'll try specific ones, sometimes I'll this, sometimes I'll do, you know, some people like you have to put a timeline on it. Some people say you don't have to put a time. And I just I feel like I'm like, oh nothing. You know, and it'll be like, okay, send me a sign if I'm supposed to go this direction. Okay, send me a sign I'm supposed to go this direction. Okay, send me a sign if I'm just supposed to stand here and not do anything. And I feel like I don't.

SPEAKER_04

So that's what I don't believe in. I believe in just taking the first steps of whatever it is I'm gonna do, and I will get stopped if it's not the right direction. So that's so I don't I never ask, should I go this way or this way? I almost always just say, This is what I'm going to do. Tell me if I need to keep doing this or if you want me to stop. And I am a believer in, and I know this partially because my religion, in feelings. So I don't ask for signs, I ask for a feeling. Do I feel at peace when I do this thing? If I don't feel at peace, if I feel in turmoil or confused, then it's not the right thing to do.

SPEAKER_03

I'm never feeling like I'm getting stopped if I'm going in the wrong direction. Because I do questions sometimes, like do I keep this? Do I not? Do I go? But I do feel like I'm constantly getting inspiration or I guess ideas, right? And so as long as I'm taking action on something, I feel like I'm constantly being guided or redirected. So it's not so much like, no, stop what you're doing, but it's like because I keep trying to do something, it's like leading me to okay, like here you go, here's this opportunity. Okay, now we're gonna see what this book does. I'm gonna move forward. And it's like I still don't know if this offer is the right thing, but it's like now you're gonna lead to this opportunity.

SPEAKER_01

Um so yeah, I feel like I have I I'm sorry. Um, I was gonna say, I feel like kind of similar to you, Natalie. I feel like I have gotten, I'll be like, oh yeah, I know this is this is something good. This is I gotta take action on this. This is gonna, I feel like I will have like an inner knowing. Um I don't trust my feelings because I feel like my feelings are much like we talked about this, how sometimes some mornings I'll wake up and I'll just be like, mm mm, for no reason. There's no difference between yesterday and the day before. And you know, sometimes I will I and I will think to myself, like, there's no reason for you to feel sad this morning. There's absolutely no reason, or there's no reason for you to feel you know, to feel anxious, or there's no reason. And so I don't I think I trust when I'm in a in a centered place and when I'm feeling not even necessarily happier, but like content when I feel like okay, I'm in a safe good place, then I feel like I'm a little bit more open to like, okay, yes, I think this this feels right. Okay, I know here's an idea. Ah, yes. And I feel like I I don't know that I have heard like heard a voice that is not mine, but I definitely have gotten ideas that it's that felt given to me. Um yeah.

SPEAKER_03

I had one meditation where I did hear a voice. Did you once in my life, and it was when I was consistently meditating in silence, and guess what the voice said? What? I want to know castor oil.

SPEAKER_00

Well, there you go. Solved latest problems solved. That's the greatest.

SPEAKER_03

I don't know what it means. I just go back some castor use it. Like I sometimes I'll put it on my stomach or on my skin for extra hydration. Like, I don't know, I don't know what I'm supposed to do with castor oil.

SPEAKER_00

Can you be more specific, voice?

SPEAKER_03

Like it was like castor oil. I'm like so I know it's possible to hear voices when you meditate.

SPEAKER_01

That's amazing. Do you think that it was just they were like practicing there? Like, all right, I gotta, I'm gonna, I'm gonna get, I'm gonna get good at like saying something to ourselves just to break through. Um castor oil.

SPEAKER_03

I was like getting an intern angel or something. They didn't know what to say. But you know what? I communicated to the universe I was listening. Yes, exactly.

SPEAKER_01

Exactly.

SPEAKER_04

Maybe with an angel who's yeah, always in a test. She's like, if I say this weird thing to her, will she do it? I'm like, yes, I will. I'll get castor oil instead of tapping a microphone. Maybe that's the problem. Neither of us, Nikki, have been through one of those tests because like now everything just comes to her. She'll just say, I think I'm thinking this and it's just gonna happen because she got through the castor oil test.

SPEAKER_03

Man. I once manifested this is like not the greatest story, but um, there was a guy I saw that was super cute. So I this like a long time ago, I like thought in my mind like about this cute guy, and I was like, oh, that'd be like cute to like get to know him. And sure as heck, like the next day he strikes up a conversation. That's crazy. That's crazy. So was this before or after castor oil? That's what I need to know. This was like way before, like something. And I'm like, oh, you do have to be careful about what you visualize and whatever, because I think it you can bring it on. So I was like, whoop.

SPEAKER_01

That's interesting. Bring on the cute boys. I know.

SPEAKER_04

Um, the one time I've heard something, I will tell you that I didn't actually, I mean, I could hear it in my mind's eye. Yeah, I don't know how to really describe it. And I knew it didn't come from me because it this is the other thing I think that happens. Uh, when I'm really praying hard for something, it usually has nothing to do with me. It was for somebody else. And so that person's name that I actually didn't know was put in my mind. That's how I knew it wasn't mine because I couldn't remember this person's name, but I knew I needed to do something for them. And so their name was put in my mind. I immediately, literally that moment, walked out the door, took care of the thing, and oh wow, it like it was crazy.

SPEAKER_01

So did you have to get them castor oil? Do all divine tablets involve castor oil? I'm just I'm just I feel like maybe you should have it in stock.

SPEAKER_04

No, no castor oil involved with mine. But I do think there's gotta be a higher power, you know, whether you believed in organized religion or not, it just feels like there's something out there.

SPEAKER_03

So and I will say sometimes, like when I'm not in the alignment or whatever, like hearing other people and their successes and what they're doing, like it kind of would bring me down a little bit. Like, what is wrong with me? What why can't I? And then recently I went to Lindsay's event, you know, the sound bath, and I was starting to feel it creep in a little bit. And I was like, I was like, no, I'm not gonna be that girl. I'm gonna be the girl that like just praises and um cheers on other people's successes. Like that's the woman I want to be because like I know that I'm successful too. And like it was just like this switch of like, I'm not gonna go there, I'm not gonna let it happen. And I really feel like since then, like I've been doing really well with just I'm on my path. I'm on my path. I'm not done, it's still going. Things come easily to me. Um, and if they don't come easily to me, it's because I don't have easy thoughts about it. And that's it. And I it's I can't force those easy thoughts right now, but I can bridge myself there and I can get myself there and I can do things that bring me joy, which is gonna make me more receptive to having easy thoughts about it. So I just feel like that's the space I'm in. But I know there will come a time when I'm not in that space again and I'll go back down and I know that I can get back out of it, you know? But it was almost like this like light switch of like, no, I'm not. I'm gonna be the ultimate hype girl. I'm gonna be the hype girl that if you are winning in life, you want to tell me because I'm gonna hype you up and I'm gonna tell everybody about it, you know. So it's like I don't want to have the negative thoughts about other people. And who do we all like better?

SPEAKER_04

We like the hype girl, right? Like we love being around the person who's excited for because I I have been in situations, I know you guys have been too, where it's almost like you don't want to tell anybody how well you're doing because you don't want them to feel badly. And so I think that is a form of I don't want to say deceit, but it's like a form of like deceit to yourself almost. Like you can't, like you can't tell ever anyone your successes because you don't want them to feel badly. And so you I don't know, it is an interesting thing, and we've all felt that, right? Where we see someone being successful and it like seeps in, and you're like, wait, where did that come from?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah. But I even like have taken it. I've always been nice on the pickleball court, but sometimes I get a little competitive and kind of upset with my partner. But I've even taken it to like recently, no matter who I'm playing with, I'm gonna hype you up. You just hit the ball in the net, it's okay, you were there, you were there, you got it, you're great. You hit it out of bounds a couple times, it's like, I know what you're capable of. We're good, we got this, let's go. It's just kind of like, why am I gonna like get frustrated or talk down? They're not trying to lose the gate. It's just like this weird switch of I don't know. I think doing that is making me happier. You know, it's making me I don't know, even though everything's not going perfect, it's feeling much, much better.

SPEAKER_04

Well, let's face it, is there ever a time when everything is going perfect? Nikki, Nikki's thinking about it. I can see her thoughts like coming out of her brain.

SPEAKER_01

But I guess I have not experienced it yet, but I would like to. I think that would be one perfect day.

SPEAKER_04

Well, it's just that there's so many facets of our lives that even if work is going well, personal maybe isn't. Yeah. If work's not going well, maybe personal is going great. Like it's, you know, health is another one, right? Like there's just enough things going on in your life that if you had total and perfect alignment in every single area, what would it even birth be worth living? I think I think the little trials and the little difficulties are actually kind of good, not just good for us, but it makes it worth grinding through another day.

SPEAKER_03

It also helps you really appreciate and enjoy when the ease and fun comes. If it was always ease and fun and joy, it would just be neutral. We know it's ease and fun and joy because we know what it feels like for hard and for sad and things like that. Another thing that was like a really interesting kind of like learning point about manifestation and just the type of like person to be. So when we were doing our sound bath recently at Lindsay's house, there was um uh like her ice machine was making noise. And then like I think like her daughter came in at one point and something strange happened. I forget what happened. It was like, oh, I think the laundry room dryer went off or something. It was like all these distractions, right? And we were coming out of it, and Lindsay goes, I just love my life. Like, I just love it. It's like her daughter like came over at one point. She's like, This is my life, and it's great. You know, it's kind of like I've got a fancy ice machine and I've got this dryer, and my daughter wants to be near me when I'm doing it. It was just like, yeah, like you could have chosen to be like, this wasn't the perfect silent sound bath. But she was like laughing, like, I just love my life. And I'm like, this is great. I'm like, yeah, that's the right attitude.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Right. And so I think that's like a another kind of way for the things to come with ease.

SPEAKER_04

But once again, isn't that really about our own thoughts and attitude? Because she could have had the thought that, oh, I wanted this perfect sound bath where I was gonna have all of this like peace, that would have been very easy, right? And I I find that to be the case. We all have these people in our lives, people who are the half as glass, the the glass is half empty versus glass is half full. And you know how many times, you know, if if you just flipped it around for them, you're like, hey, look, this is what happened today. You said that it was this, but also you also said it was this, but you're taking this downward turn, and you're like, I mean, we really do build our own realities.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, and it's a little bit like the half empty, half full. I'm now seeing it as a low vibe, high vibe. Like high vibe people get higher vibes, they get more of that vibration, more of the manifestation. Low vibe, not moving, not doing much, getting the same thing. You're gonna get that, you know. So I'm starting to like see it all, you know. So anyway, it's kind of one of the reasons I'm like, I'm excited to go do a guitar lesson. I don't know. I don't know, kind of be probably the oldest person getting a freaking lesson there, but like let's give it a try and see how it goes. And um, it's also why sometimes I just take a break and go play pickleball because I'm like, hey, like I know I have a ton more work to do, but I'm not quite sure this is the direction I'm even supposed to be going. So let's see, you know.

SPEAKER_04

I think it's brave to try something new when you're older. We just did Charlie's violin recital, and there was a woman in her probably 40s or 50s who played at the recital. It was clear like she had been taking lessons for the last couple of years. And I was like, that is good on her. Like, I'm not brave enough to come back and be like, maybe I should learn the violin again. That I mean, that's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_01

It's funny. It's I feel like that's the kind of stuff like when you're when you're younger, when you're a kid or when you're a teenager, and you're like, oh my God, that would be so embarrassing. It'd be so embarrassing to be different. It would be so embarrassing. But and once you get older and you have some perspective, you're like, damn, no, that's cool. Awesome, awesome to be different, awesome to be to be doing something you love, and awesome to be like, hey, yeah, I'm the one 50-year-old amongst these six-year-olds. That's that in and of itself is awesome. Like, how adorable is that? Yeah, that's funny.

SPEAKER_04

Well, and ironically, especially as business owners, the thing that I feel like I spend all my time telling my designers to do is differentiate and stand out and be different. But we spend our entire lives trying to fit in. Think about high school. Oh, I just wanted to fit in and I wanted to have the same clothes as everyone else. And I just I didn't want to stand out at all. And now, ironically, all I want to do is stand out. And it's so hard. I think that might be the end of this episode.

SPEAKER_01

I feel like I have some stuff to work on and some no, not work on. That's no, stop working, Nick. I feel like I have some stuff to embrace and explore based on this episode, and some stuff to release. Love it.